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Dreadfully bored with theology

I wonder if readers can identify the source of this quote, in which the speaker is asked to explain why churches are growing:

Two ways. One is a demand answer; one is a supply answer. The demand answer is simple. There are so many young, educated people who are struggling with ambition and isolation. They come out of a blue-collar background or a farm background and find themselves working in the jungle of Los Angeles or Cincinnati. They need something to offset that intensely competitive, high-pressure, high-stress environment. They need something that they may not be conscious of, but something that restores balance and sanity. They need community. On the supply side, more and more churches are what I call "pastoral churches." Their purpose is not to perpetuate a particular liturgy or maintain an existing institutional form. Instead, they're asking what my business friends would call the marketing question: "Who are the customers, and what's of value to them?" They're more interested in the pastoral question ("What do these people need that we can supply?") than in the theological nuances ("How can we preserve our distinctive doctrines?"). These churches are growing partly because the younger people need pastoring and not just preaching, and partly because, very bluntly, people are dreadfully bored with theology. They can't appreciate the subtleties. And I sympathize with them. I taught religion; I didn't teach theology. I've always felt that quite clearly the good Lord loves diversity.

Posted on Aug 22, 2011 in church, culture by Wes Kenney 1 Comment

Cruise Directors and Other Officers of the Church

I recently had a Facebook conversation with a pastor friend in another city who was sharing his frustrations over difficulties he was having with a staff member. Apparently his youth pastor was leaving after a short tenure because “God was telling him” it was time to leave. Leaving aside my skepticism for anyone who claims to be getting direct revelation from God, this conversation caused me to think more about the kinds of relationships churches often have with ministers other than the pastor. Of course, there is no mention of a “youth minister” in the Bible. But I know they exist, because I used to be one, and it is a curious relationship. Each of the four churches I served in this capacity insisted that I meet the biblical qualifications of an elder as laid out in the pastoral epistles, yet none of them viewed me as someone serving in the role of an elder. In fact, I’m convinced that some of them desired me to function more like Julie McCoy on “The Love Boat.” My friends who come from a more Calvinistic perspective are insistent that a church be governed by a plurality of elders. The ones who are also good Baptists will substitute “led” for “governed.” But they certainly have a point to make biblically when it comes to the plural nature of the office. While there is biblical warrant for the idea of an individual elder leading a church, elders are most often referred to in the plural. But my conversation with my friend has me thinking that perhaps there is a healthier middle ground. While it may already be implicit in larger congregations, I have found very few where those men serving on staff are explicitly recognized by the congregation as “elders” in the biblical sense. Indeed, it is much more common (and devastatingly unbiblical) for church members to view the deacons in that way, and to view these staff ministers simply as hired hands. As someone who was once fired without notice by a group of deacons (who then fired the pastor in similar, though slightly kinder, fashion), I know whereof I speak. But this post isn’t about deacons, it’s about elders. What I’m suggesting is that churches ought to become much more intentional about viewing those on what is commonly called “the ministerial staff” as elders, and not simply as guys hired to lead worship/youth ministry/children’s ministry. This intentionality must begin with the writing of a job description, and continue through recruiting and calling someone to serve a congregation. The way people approach a “youth director” will be much different from the way they approach an elder to whom the church has given the responsibility for oversight of the youth ministry. The same holds true for the “song leader,” the “education director,” and so on. If a church approaches these roles with this kind of biblical seriousness, it seems to me that difficulties like the one my pastor friend face will become fewer and further between. Amazing how often that’s true when we seek greater faithfulness to what scripture teaches.

Posted on Jul 20, 2011 in church, ministry by Wes Kenney 5 Comments

VBS and Invitations

Last week my son, who is six years old, responded to an invitation given at a vacation Bible school he attended at another church in our community. From what I understand, there were many who responded, and he left there expressing confidence that he was now saved because he had prayed a prayer. My boy is asking some very good questions concerning the gospel, and I believe that he is moving toward the point of having saving faith, but I don’t think he has an adequate understanding of his own personal guilt, the punishment it deserves, and Christ’s work in bearing that punishment in his place. By God’s grace, he will get there. He’s headed in the right direction. But this episode has caused me to think about the practice of VBS invitations, and I believe there is much more caution needed than there is caution exercised in our churches when it comes to this issue. I’m aware of a church not far from where I serve where the pastor did something rather disturbing last year. When it came to the time for an invitation to trust Christ to be extended, all the younger children were dismissed, leaving only children in grades 4-6 in the room. This is commendable, and this step would make it seem that this pastor was understanding of the need to avoid emotionalism, and that he was trying to avoid false conversions. But what happened next was startling. With only the older children now present, he outlined the ABC’s of becoming a Christian, and if you’re a Southern Baptist involved in VBS, you can sing these to at least four or five different tunes, courtesy of the freakishly talented Jeff Slaughter. After his presentation, he told everyone present to bow their heads, close their eyes, and repeat after him as he led them in a “sinner’s prayer*.” When he was done, he said that all who had prayed that prayer (which he had just instructed them to pray) should come to the front, publicly professing their new-found faith in Christ. The following Sunday, this pastor stood before his church and announced that every single child in grades 4-6 who attended their VBS had been saved that week. Many of them were presented to the church that Sunday or following Sundays as candidates for baptism, and most were subsequently baptized. But not all. I heard this story from the parent of one girl in that group, who responded as directed to the VBS invitation, but later recognized that nothing had changed in her heart, and she was only responding because that’s what everyone in the room was told to do. Her family is very involved in the church, and they’re there almost every Sunday. So, the pastor came looking for her. He took her out of Sunday School, without her parent’s knowledge, and asked her why she hadn’t presented herself for baptism. As far as I know, the child has not yet been baptized. There are many forms of spiritual abuse. Men who use their positions of ecclesial authority in order to subjugate or gain favors from women are despicable. Those who would use their power in order to keep wrongdoing from being brought to light will face the harsh judgment of their all-seeing Creator. But in terms of eternal consequences, I’d be hard pressed to identify much that is worse than gaining, by coercion of peer pressure or other manipulative tactics, a false profession of faith in Christ from a child. For my son, and the girl in the story above, the damage is minor, and temporary. I believe in the promises of God, and have confidence that these children are being trained up in the way they should go, and they’ll have full opportunity to hear, understand, and respond to the gospel. But for so many of the children who populate our VBS rolls each summer, this is the only contact they have with our churches, or any church. To offer assurance of salvation to someone who may never hear the truth again simply because they correctly repeated several sentences with their eyes closed may have consequences far greater than any other kind of spiritual abuse I can imagine, because those consequences may be eternal. I love VBS. I love the way the Bible lessons and Jeff Slaughter’s music imprint truth from God’s Word upon young hearts. But we must be cautious. In our zeal to see children come to faith in Christ, we must make sure that it is the work of the Holy Spirit, and not the result of our own manipulation, that has done the converting. Only one of these actually has the power to bring new life. _____________________________________ *I’m all for sinners praying, but I will never tell someone who wants to become a Christian what the content of that prayer ought to be. I’ll explain what the Bible says about how one is saved, and leave the wording up to the individual and the Holy Spirit.

Posted on Jun 23, 2011 in church, evangelism, VBS by Wes Kenney 12 Comments

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I'm looking forward to hearing these testimonies, Deltasone 500mg, Kjøpe Deltasone online, bestill Deltasone online, and to hearing a challenging message from Dr. Jerry Rankin, canada, mexico, india. Fort Worth, Texas. Denver, Colorado, And I'm excited about being able to share these experiences with some of the people of my church this evening. Købe Deltasone online, αγοράζουν online Deltasone. 400mg, 450mg. Jacksonville, Florida, Columbus, Ohio. Boston, Massachusetts. Charlotte, Carolina. Deltasone coupon. Australia, uk, us, usa. Where can i order Deltasone without prescription. Deltasone from mexico. Japan, craiglist, ebay, hcl. Deltasone 100mg. Indianapolis, Indiana, San Francisco, California. Deltasone 800mg, 875mg, 900mg. Deltasone from canada. Deltasone 75mg. Deltasone without prescription. Purchase Deltasone online. Deltasone FOR SALE.

Posted on Apr 9, 2008 in challenge, church, missions by Wes Kenney 0 Comments

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Wade Burleson has written a post today regarding an article in a Memphis newspaper about Bellevue Baptist Church Karela FOR SALE, 's mission work in India. His post contains the following paragraph (emphasis original):

Though I am not sympathetic with the anti-missionary viewpoint of the articleâ€™s author, rx free Karela, Karela from canada, I was struck by a little detail or two related to baptism and ecclesiology. It appears that women from many villages across the Indian state of Andhra Pradesh came to a training center run by an Indian evangelist named Sathuluri who hosted a training program for village women that was fully - and solely - sponsored by Bellevue Baptist Church, order Karela online c.o.d. Karela over the counter, During the course of the training event, at least one village woman, no prescription Karela online, Karela without a prescription, and implicit within the article - many more women - were baptized. There was no local church involved in the baptism, cheap Karela no rx. Women from all over the state were baptized by an evangelist, but they did not become members of any 'local' church that day, Karela FOR SALE. Karela 500mg, The women identified themselves with Christ - baptized at the hands of the evangelist who led them to Christ. This non-local church based baptismal service raises questions of inconsistency when juxtaposed to Dr, where can i find Karela online. Online buying Karela, John Floydâ€™s, Mid-America's, japan, craiglist, ebay, hcl, Karela in cats, dogs, children, and the 'new' (2005) IMB Baptism Position Paper that all posit an inflexible insistence that proper baptism is to be conducted only as an ordinance of the local church.

In this paragraph, it is stated as fact that "there was no local church involved in the baptism." My first reaction upon reading this was, Karela 800mg, 875mg, 900mg, Order Karela from mexican pharmacy, "You mean, other than Bellevue?"

I am firmly convinced that, Karela 150mg, Karela 50mg, as the Baptist Faith and Message states, baptism is an ordinance of the local church, Karela 1000mg, 2000mg. San Diego, California. Dallas, Texas. San Antonio, Texas, I do not believe that this means the only valid baptisms are those conducted in a heated pool inside a brick building by a man with a certificate of ordination hanging on his office wall. Karela FOR SALE, Rather, it means that there is no scriptural baptism outside the authority given by Christ to the local church. The church may authorize anyone it wishes, acheter en ligne Karela, acheter Karela bon marché, Karela FOR SALE, from the pastor to the custodian to a missionary member, to baptize converts anywhere, farmacia Karela baratos, Karela online kaufen, Karela 250mg, from the baptistry to a swimming pool to the Indus River.

So when I read about these baptisms, online Karela without a prescription, Australia, uk, us, usa, my natural conclusion is to assume that one sent by Bellevue Baptist Church to carry out the work of evangelism is baptizing converts under the authority of Bellevue Baptist Church, which is perfectly within their right and perfectly consistent with the IMB baptism guideline which Wade seeks to undermine with his post, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Phoenix, Arizona. Indianapolis, Indiana, San Francisco, California, But this was just an assumption. In order to find out whether my assumption was justified, Karela 125mg, New York. Los Angeles, California, I contacted Steve Marcum, who serves as Minister of Missions at Bellevue, Karela coupon. I found out that my assumption was not, in fact, justified, Karela FOR SALE. Karela without prescription, Rather than baptizing under the authority of Bellevue Baptist Church, Steve told me that the baptisms referred to in the article in question all took place under the authority of local churches in India, Karela online cod. Austin, Texas, Memphis, Tennessee, So despite the fact that Wade repeatedly tells his readers that no local church was involved in these baptisms, it just isn't true, Boston, Massachusetts. Charlotte, Carolina. Karela withdrawal, Another thing that is misleading about Wade's post are the gymnastics he goes through to link Bellevue Baptist Church with Mid-America Baptist Theological Seminary, where IMB trustee chairman Dr, where can i Karela online. John Floyd is employed. Karela FOR SALE, I can only assume that the reason this connection is necessary is to try to show some inconsistency in Dr. Floyd's position on baptism, an inconsistency that evaporates when the sunlight of truth shines through.

My conversation with Steve Marcum revealed that there is no official connection between his church and the school. It was not founded by Bellevue, and though they have supported it financially through the years and continue to do so, many other churches, ministries, and individuals do this as well; Bellevue is not unique in this regard.

It took me about three minutes to locate the name and phone number for Steve Marcum, who returned my call within the hour. It took another five minutes on the phone with him to confirm the information I have presented here. But rather than check the facts for himself, Wade published a post that contains false and misleading information in order to make a point.

Posted on Dec 10, 2007 in baptism, bloggers, church by Wes Kenney 41 Comments

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Duprost FOR SALE, The title of this post represents a practice in Southern Baptist life that has always concerned me. Contained within this phrase is the idea that a person's membership in a local church somehow has its substance in a "letter" that can be moved from place to place, Duprost price. Jacksonville, Florida, Columbus, Ohio, It is not a covenant relationship, but a clerical exercise, australia, uk, us, usa. Reasons to Duprost online, But is this practice in any way biblical.

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- Acts 18:24-28 (ESV)

This passage seems to be about as close as one can come to a biblical argument for our practice of "letters of recommendation, Duprost 500mg, Boston, Massachusetts. Charlotte, Carolina, " although it strikes me as more of a ministerial recommendation that one for membership. And I don't think I would be at all uncomfortable with a practice by that name if it had any real resemblance to the mental image that the phrase "letter of recommendation" creates in most people, Duprost from canada. Fort Worth, Texas. Denver, Colorado, One could reasonably expect that, in the case of a member in good standing, online buying Duprost, Duprost 250mg, there would be some discussion about a person's contribution to their local church, their giftedness, Duprost online cod, Where can i order Duprost without prescription, and their ability to serve the local church. The person would have discussed their need to join another congregation with the leaders of their present church, online Duprost without a prescription, Duprost without a prescription, and everyone would be aware of the impending move. A letter would be drafted detailing the person's experience of salvation and baptism, their history of service, and the current church's good wishes to the sister congregation, Duprost FOR SALE. But our practice of granting letters really isn't anything like that, Duprost in cats, dogs, children. Comprar en línea Duprost, comprar Duprost baratos, In my experience, the granting of letters is a footnote in a business meeting wherein the clerk reads the name of a member and the church requesting a letter, Duprost no prescription, Duprost 150mg, someone makes a motion, and the "letter" is granted (sometimes after a discussion in which someone suggests that the person may, New York. Los Angeles, California, Baltimore, Maryland. Milwaukee, Wisconsin, in fact, be dead), Duprost 125mg. Duprost 1000mg, 2000mg, The clerk then fills out a card (available here), and the person is removed as a member, Detroit, Michigan, San Jose, California. There is no discussion of whether the person even gives evidence of being a Christian, much less whether they are someone who should be the subject of a "letter of recommendation."

In the two years I have served as pastor of my current church, I have made a handful of phone calls to pastors, either when receiving a request for a letter or when someone I know to be a member of a nearby church shows interest in joining here. Duprost FOR SALE, In each and every case, I have been treated quite dismissively, usually after the pastor with whom I am talking gets over their surprise that anyone would even waste a phone call on such a matter. Needless to say, these experiences have been discouraging.

I leave for the comments a couple of questions. First, do the things I have written about here even constitute a problem. And if so, what are some practical solutions. Cyle Clayton has written an excellent piece on this subject over at sbc IMPACT! which spurred the thinking that led to this somewhat rambling post. I encourage you to read and interact with what he has written as well.

There seems to be a growing resurgence in SBC life of a concern for authentic church membership. What part does this practice of "moving letters" play in the degradation of the integrity of membership in a local church.

Posted on Nov 5, 2007 in church, membership, SBC issues by Wes Kenney 12 Comments

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I believe that we are often guilty of presenting our music and our prayers to the Lord as an end of itself, reasons to Lukol online, Where can i Lukol online, when God's desire is that we come to Him with clean hands and a pure heart. The song we sing and play for Him must be the song that has come as the cry of our hearts, Lukol without a prescription, Baltimore, Maryland. Milwaukee, Wisconsin, not some religious rite. This is why God rebukes the religious in Amos 5, Lukol samples. Cheap Lukol no rx, He is looking to the heart. Lukol FOR SALE, His desire is that we be real with Him. He already knows our hearts, order Lukol online overnight delivery no prescription, Lukol 500mg, so why do we play games with Him in our worship experiences. God's desire is that we walk according to His Word day after day, Detroit, Michigan, San Jose, California. Lukol over the counter, If we do, corporate worship will be much sweeter because it will come as an outpouring of what God has done in our lives all week long, Lukol 100mg. Lukol from mexico, Praise the Lord. I will praise the Lord with my whole heart, El Paso, Texas. Washington, D.C. Seattle, Washington, Indianapolis, Indiana, San Francisco, California, in the assembly of the upright and in the congregation. -Psalm 111:1, Lukol from canadian pharmacy. Comprar en línea Lukol, comprar Lukol baratos. Lukol from canada. Order Lukol no prescription. Lukol 800mg, 875mg, 900mg. Order Lukol online c.o.d. Lukol 50mg.

Posted on Oct 2, 2007 in BGCO, church, worship by Wes Kenney 1 Comment

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